The Housing Policy Council is a policy and trade organization with a unique mission and membership. HPC’s members are leaders in housing finance, representing the primary market’s ecosystem of mortgage lenders and servicers; data, technology, and analytics firms; and mortgage, title and property insurers.
Collectively, HPC member companies are the nucleus of the U.S. housing finance system, supporting the flow of capital from across the globe into the mortgage market to serve all Americans who are or aspire to become homeowners. I am proud to advocate on their behalf, because HPC member companies take very seriously their role in the marketplace and their responsibility to promote and support sustainable homeownership opportunities.
Meg and I sat down on December 8, 2020 and discussed the current state of the market and the trends we are observing. This interview continues an executive interview series I conduct to shed light on how women leaders built their careers and successfully managed an integral industry change.
Faith Schwartz: Meg, I got to know you during the great Recession of 2008, when you worked at the FHA at HUD. Tell me what your path was to government service?
Meg Burns: I love this question, Faith – honestly, my path was paved with good fortune. I was often at the right place at the right time and never passed up an opportunity. I had a phenomenal career in government, and it all started from nothing. Zero family resources or connections to rely on and a national recession in 1990-91 drove me to Washington DC, where I figured I could get a job. I had a degree in philosophy, so I had a core skill set – I could think and I could write. But, I sure didn’t know anything about public policy and certainly not housing policy. Fortunately, I had a college friend at HUD who helped me apply for an intern program, which was cancelled after I interviewed with a couple of offices, but one of the offices hired me into a low-level policy position. I was tasked with producing policy materials for both FHA and the HUD Secretary’s office. That type of work is critical in government and I was good at it, so found a way to keep moving into new positions and taking on new challenges. I loved the work and the constant change that you find in government – change in leadership, issues, policy approaches, market forces, national economic conditions, and so much more. That constant change creates an intellectually stimulating environment and an opportunity to be a part of a fascinating and evolving set of policy discussions in Washington.
FS: What were the three most important things you worked on when you were at HUD?
MB: It’s hard to point to only three, but one that immediately comes to mind was the National Homeownership Strategy in the early 1990s, mainly because so much of the work taught me the importance of partnerships between the government, industry, and the advocacy community, a lesson that is still so relevant to all that I do today. Prior to becoming fully immersed in single family residential finance issues as I am today, I worked for a few years on multifamily affordable rental policy and was privileged to work on HUD’s worst case needs reports and Section 8 policy issues. I even moved to Minneapolis, MN to work out of a HUD field office on multifamily issues. Another piece of important work was managing HUD’s housing counseling program, which was often overlooked in a bureaucracy with so many competing priorities but is a critical support for many of HUD’s other program activities. I know that’s three, but I would be remiss if I didn’t mention the work done during the financial crisis of 2007-2008, when HUD was coordinating with the other executive and regulatory agencies to stand up the broad set of relief programs for households in need. That experience and the learnings from those efforts have served us well during this COVID challenge.
FS: You transitioned to FHFA, the regulator and conservator for the Government sponsored enterprises. Why did you go to FHFA?
MB: You know, I had been at HUD and FHA for 20-plus years and I decided that I needed to leave my comfort zone and expand my housing finance knowledge. I had already identified FHFA as a good place to consider when someone contacted me to say that FHFA had a job opening that seemed like a match for me.
FS: What role did you play there?
MB: I was hired to oversee the Office of Congressional Affairs and Communications at FHFA. It was not the type of position that I had planned to pursue, but FHFA was looking to hire someone into that role who knew housing finance, who understood the GSE business and the industry. Ironically, given the Conservator role of the FHFA, my policy background came in very handy in that position and when Ed DeMarco reorganized the agency and set up an actual policy office to handle the policy function that was needed to manage the Conservatorship, I immediately moved into that office, which is called the Office of Housing and Regulatory Policy.
FS: What were the most important learnings of your time at FHFA?
MB: I had the opportunity to peer behind the Oz curtain to see the internal operations of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, which was extremely enlightening. I now really understand and appreciate the true strengths and weaknesses that exist within the GSE infrastructure. The employees at both of those companies are incredibly talented and smart and dedicated to their missions, so I very much enjoyed working with all of them, but as with any company, they have plenty of operational challenges to contend with and it was useful to see that first-hand.
FS: You were there during a stressful time of transition in housing. This is also the time you ended up working closely with Acting Director Ed DeMarco. What were the themes of the organization at that time?
MB: No surprise, we were focused first and foremost on stabilizing the GSEs and using their market role to bring stability to the rest of the marketplace. During my stint, a lot of energy was dedicated to crisis recovery, including a focus on aligning the servicing policies of the GSEs and using their market position to lead the loss mitigation efforts in Washington; setting up other types of programs, like HARP to permit more refinancing for “underwater” borrowers; developing the REO-to-rental pilot to create a model to move the vacant, foreclosed properties into the rental segment of the market, overhauling the rep and warrant framework for the GSEs to improve the balance of risk and responsibilities across counterparties. With all that we did, I’d say that the core theme was restoration of the mortgage market.
FS: Full circle: You are now a very accomplished housing policy leader as Executive Vice President of the Housing Policy Council, a trade organization representing the largest mortgage bankers, bankers and mortgage insurers in the housing industry. I loved my time working with this group long ago when I led HOPE NOW. What do you do in this role?
MB: As the EVP, I am responsible for coordinating and overseeing our policy, advocacy, and membership work, but I started at HPC as the SVP for Mortgage Policy, so I’m still very involved in managing a number of our policy working groups.
FS: What words of advice can you offer to young women or men who are wondering how to work inside of our Government agencies?
MB: Never say no. Never let an opportunity pass you by. I guess that this universal advice, but in government, there are a lot of ways to add value, given the resource constraints that all agencies face. So, proactive offers to contribute are generally welcomed and can definitely help a young person advance his or her career.
FS: What do you like most about the private sector versus government service?
MB: You know, I love them both. The private sector is liberating; I’m not affected by agency restrictions on information sharing, strict hierarchies, and severe resource limitations. But, government is empowering as well, because you’re responsible for the actual administration of programs and have control over the policy-making. Here in the private sector, we’re simply hoping to use our technical knowledge to help influence government policy. In both places, however, one of the best elements is the people – from the government, the industry, and the advocacy community. To me, housing stakeholders are a truly dedicated and intelligent group of individuals and I very much enjoy being a part of this broad community.
FS: Any parting thoughts?
MB: I want to thank you, Faith, for all that you do for our industry. You should know that you serve as a real role model for so many professionals, routinely demonstrating what it means to be a true leader, tackling tough issues, dedicating time and attention to those most in need, and supporting one another.
At Housing Finance Strategies, we are leading change in all things housing. By interviewing key executives like Meg Burns, our intent is to educate and encourage the industry to constantly grow and evolve. And take a lesson from Meg, experience and patience pay dividends for all of the mortgage industry. Grow, lead and mentor your peers!
To learn more about the Housing Policy Council, visit https://www.housingpolicycouncil.org/.